my high flow 2 reports 1° too high, but i don't know the margin of error on PTCs.. it may still be in spec.
There's no hot electronics in that one :p

Zitat von »Stephan«

The high flow NEXT temperature sensor doesn't work correctly when there is no flow.
Of course the complete device including the sensor will heat up due the heat of the LEDs, Display, PCB. So you need at least a small flow to measure exactly.
If a flow is applied it's one of the best water temperature sensors available at the market and less influenced by ambient air then many other sensors.

"The high flow NEXT temperature sensor doesn't work correctly when there is no flow."
How does the 'Automatic offset compensation in standby' work?

Hi Guys

i have problem with NEXT. When i set invert screen, it don't save this setting. When i turn off/on pc again, i must go to aq software and set the same setting one more time . What can be wrong ?

Zitat von »InfoSeeker«

Zitat von »Stephan«

The high flow NEXT temperature sensor doesn't work correctly when there is no flow.
Of course the complete device including the sensor will heat up due the heat of the LEDs, Display, PCB. So you need at least a small flow to measure exactly.
If a flow is applied it's one of the best water temperature sensors available at the market and less influenced by ambient air then many other sensors.

"The high flow NEXT temperature sensor doesn't work correctly when there is no flow."
How does the 'Automatic offset compensation in standby' work?

In the High Flow NEXT manual I see the following"

Zitat

8.7. Power measurement
{snip}
The automatic offset calibration during standby can be activated for improved ac-
curacy. When active, internal and external temperature sensor readings will be
matched during prolonged shutdown of the PC.

My question is, how can the internal and external sensors be 'matched' during standby when the primary (internal) sensor is not reliable at standby (zero flow condition)?

finally kicked my high flow next in to action...it's probably not in an ideal place but it's in the place where it can go and i can still fit the sidepanel on...
wondering though i have a external temperature sensor attached (i actually have 2 in my system one to help out the octo and one for the high flow next's gimmicks) but all 3 of these give me a different temperature and the highest is the highflow next so the powerdraw calculations will be a joke at best
the way my loop is layed out the octo's sensor is attached to the last radiator, 15cm past that is the next (so these 2 should be close but are instead well atm 29.4 for the octo 30.15 for the next, then comes my gpu and cpu which granted at the moment aren't dooing much but the vision sensor which is before the 1st radiator reads the by far lowest temperature of 29.2 >.>)

do i just raise the vision sensor to ow this seems to make sense range or drop the NEXT to well it's now closer to the other 2...

edit : ow crap that's what the automatic temperature offset stuff is for >.> derp

is there a way to change the flow readout on the screen to liters / minute instead of hour though? have it set to minute everywhere else but the display insists on it being per hour.
hmmm ran the offset calibration on standby and before i was between 120-40w (as it the next was hotter then the sensor before the radiators the part of my loop that puts out heat was actually pushing the power closer to 0)

but now it's claiming that my cpu and gpu are draining 680-750w from the cooling >.> if i offset the pre radiator fitting to be atleast slightly above the next....the power go's to 800-900w >.> i am quite confused.

hmm it could be....the radiator fans currently on there (planning to replace them but the replacents haven't released yet) but they have a tiny gap between the fan and the radiator....wonder if it's pushing air on the sensor fitting cooling it beyond what just the water does...because it should really be the hottest temperature measured in the loop (just behind the gpu and cpu) but it's still showing the lowest temperature in the loop >.>



or it's trying to tell me that my radiators are extracting 750-800w which seems highly unlikely for a 360 slim with 3 fans and 240 medium with pushpull fan's running 25-66% (2400rpm at 100%)
edit :
manually played with the offsets it's now giving me a....reasonable representation of what's happening between the Next and the flow sensor on the cpu / gpu side (though isn't it supposed to calculate what the radiators are doing or did i misunderstand...

it's currently reporting around 40w idle (seems reasonable for a idle 3900x with a propper 0.3v idle and a 2070s) and when i kick on cinebench to take the cpu from a 20-25w package to a 130-135w one the power measured raises accordingly to 150-155

final edit: just tossed in the EK cryofuel to set up the water quality accordingly and...ehr....does cooling liquid start to expire once the bottle has been opened? it looks like cryofuel and smells like it but...conductivity 31.4....i was under the assumption it would be silly high according to what i've read here on the forums, demineralised water measured in at 145 ish...

Yeah my highflow next records the highest temperature in my loop, but is right after the radiators so it should be the coldest water in it - not too sure what is happening there!

I'm also not sure what is happening with the water conductivity count not sure if demineralised water is the same as distilled? I've been using distilled water and it started on the low end (conductivity was much lower yours).


I'm having a different issue - as soon as my flow is over 150 the 'click' in the flow meter is so loud I can hear it outside of my case, by the time it gets to 250 unless I have the sound loud or my noise cancelling headphones on - and it's driving me nuts with how loud it is. Is it meant to? Is there anything I can do to fix this? (Been running over a month so shouldn't have any bubbles in it).

for the clicking , i only get it when the flowmeter is installed for vertical flow (high flow 2, not the Next). When set horizontally, it's totally silent.

The flow unit is in Aquasuite settings, not in the sensor settings just remember to adjust your virtual sensor for power dissipation accordingly. The flow is so small in liters/minute, i personally prefer seeing it in L/h, no fiddling with decimals

aaaaand.. i have the same problem with the water temperature. the flow meter sensor is almost 1°C higher than the radiator intake (hottest), despite being installed AFTER the first of 3 rads.
I just don't use it, and have two identical in line sensors for power dissipation calculation. The only thiing you could do is strap like a muntimeter thermocouple to the fitting, insulate it well and take measurements to calibrate the sensors in Aquasuite with the offsets. That should get you pretty close

Zitat von »anub1s21«

finally kicked my high flow next in to action...it's probably not in an ideal place but it's in the place where it can go and i can still fit the sidepanel on...
wondering though i have a external temperature sensor attached (i actually have 2 in my system one to help out the octo and one for the high flow next's gimmicks) but all 3 of these give me a different temperature and the highest is the highflow next so the powerdraw calculations will be a joke at best :P
the way my loop is layed out the octo's sensor is attached to the last radiator, 15cm past that is the next (so these 2 should be close but are instead well atm 29.4 for the octo 30.15 for the next, then comes my gpu and cpu which granted at the moment aren't dooing much but the vision sensor which is before the 1st radiator reads the by far lowest temperature of 29.2 >.>)

do i just raise the vision sensor to ow this seems to make sense range or drop the NEXT to well it's now closer to the other 2...

edit : ow crap that's what the automatic temperature offset stuff is for >.> derp

I would not use the 'Automatic offset compensation in standby' option.
The internal temperature sensor in the Flow NEXT is biased due to it's proximity to the internal electronics. When coolant is flowing, this bias is overwhelmed and the sensor appears to read an accurate coolant temperature. But when there is no coolant flow (standby mode) the sensor experiences a 2 to 3 degree temperature increase over the stagnant coolant.

If this raised temperature is then applied to the external temperature sensor, the external sensor will be off by 2 to 3 degrees. The bias on the internal sensor will again be overwhelmed when coolant flows, but the external sensor will remain incorrectly biased by 2 to 3 degrees.

I made a simple test setup, with the only heat source being the pump (setup.jpg)
Flow NEXT relationship to External Sensor (hfn_ext.jpg)
Charts showing temperature sensor status according to coolant flow (flow_next_temps.jpg)

• at start, when the hubby7 gets plugged in, with pump unplugged, both internal and external sensors are within 0.1° (28.8 vs. 28.9)
  
• the Flow NEXT internal rises as time goes by
  
• when I activate the pump, the Flow NEXT internal sensor drops quickly while the external sensor remains steady
  
• when I de-activate the pump again, the Flow NEXT internal sensor rises, while the external sensor remains steady
  
• that is what 'standby mode' looks like, and matching the external sensor to the Flow NEXT internals sensor would introduce a large error to the external sensor

Zitat

is there a way to change the flow readout on the screen to liters / minute instead of hour though? have it set to minute everywhere else but the display insists on it being per hour.
hmmm ran the offset calibration on standby and before i was between 120-40w (as it the next was hotter then the sensor before the radiators the part of my loop that puts out heat was actually pushing the power closer to 0)

but now it's claiming that my cpu and gpu are draining 680-750w from the cooling >.> if i offset the pre radiator fitting to be atleast slightly above the next....the power go's to 800-900w >.> i am quite confused.

hmm it could be....the radiator fans currently on there (planning to replace them but the replacents haven't released yet) but they have a tiny gap between the fan and the radiator....wonder if it's pushing air on the sensor fitting cooling it beyond what just the water does...because it should really be the hottest temperature measured in the loop (just behind the gpu and cpu) but it's still showing the lowest temperature in the loop >.>



or it's trying to tell me that my radiators are extracting 750-800w which seems highly unlikely for a 360 slim with 3 fans and 240 medium with pushpull fan's running 25-66% (2400rpm at 100%)
edit :
manually played with the offsets it's now giving me a....reasonable representation of what's happening between the Next and the flow sensor on the cpu / gpu side (though isn't it supposed to calculate what the radiators are doing or did i misunderstand...

it's currently reporting around 40w idle (seems reasonable for a idle 3900x with a propper 0.3v idle and a 2070s) and when i kick on cinebench to take the cpu from a 20-25w package to a 130-135w one the power measured raises accordingly to 150-155

final edit: just tossed in the EK cryofuel to set up the water quality accordingly and...ehr....does cooling liquid start to expire once the bottle has been opened? it looks like cryofuel and smells like it but...conductivity 31.4....i was under the assumption it would be silly high according to what i've read here on the forums, demineralised water measured in at 145 ish...

EK Cryofuel is not compatible with the Flow NEXT coolant condition monitor.

• the Flow NEXT tests for impurities in the coolant. The lower the conductivity, the less impurities in the coolant, consequently, a lower chance of electrolysis.
  
• EK Cryofuel has additives to 'give up' electrons as electrolysis occurs, consequently, there is a high level of impurities as a default, and conductivity is high.
  

Zitat

I would not use the 'Automatic offset compensation in standby' option.
The
internal temperature sensor in the Flow NEXT is biased due to it's
proximity to the internal electronics. When coolant is flowing, this
bias is overwhelmed and the sensor appears to read an accurate coolant
temperature. But when there is no coolant flow (standby mode) the sensor
experiences a 2 to 3 degree temperature increase over the stagnant
coolant.

If this raised temperature is then applied to the
external temperature sensor, the external sensor will be off by 2 to 3
degrees. The bias on the internal sensor will again be overwhelmed when
coolant flows, but the external sensor will remain incorrectly biased by
2 to 3 degrees.

I made a simple test setup, with the only heat source being the pump ([attach]8687[/attach])
Flow NEXT relationship to External Sensor ([attach]8688[/attach])
Charts showing temperature sensor status according to coolant flow ([attach]8690[/attach])

• at
  start, when the hubby7 gets plugged in, with pump unplugged, both
  internal and external sensors are within 0.1° (28.8 vs. 28.9)
  
• the Flow NEXT internal rises as time goes by
  
• when I activate the pump, the Flow NEXT internal sensor drops quickly while the external sensor remains steady
  
• when I de-activate the pump again, the Flow NEXT internal sensor rises, while the external sensor remains steady
  
• that is what 'standby mode' looks like, and matching the
  external sensor to the Flow NEXT internals sensor would introduce a
  large error to the external sensor

EK Cryofuel is not compatible with the Flow NEXT coolant condition monitor.

• the
  Flow NEXT tests for impurities in the coolant. The lower the
  conductivity, the less impurities in the coolant, consequently, a lower
  chance of electrolysis.
  
• EK Cryofuel has additives to 'give up' electrons as
  electrolysis occurs, consequently, there is a high level of impurities
  as a default, and conductivity is high.
  

yea noticed your post on that feature and it indeed doesn't quite seem to work as intended unless you keep your pump powered wile the pc is off >.>
and with the cryofuel that's what i was expecting but demineralised water read at 140 whatever that unit of conductivity is which i assume is high, and the fresh...i think... cryofuel came in at 35 (now a week later it's sitting at 20)....this...is not the behavior i expected from this fluid... well it is in the way that it's sacrificing conductivity but it's
starting point and current point are much lower then i expected,
wouldn't 30 and 20 conductivity be lower then fresh AC DP ultra?
which...does not seem right.

the bottle was already opened during the previous maintenance to top off my loop but the fluid wasn't used yet, it was a bit foamy when i put it in so i opened my final bottle to do a smell test and they at least smelled identical so i don't know maybe it starts to degrade as soon as it's unsealed?

DI water comes in all sorts of flavours.. and in the supermarket you don't really know what you get. As you said, it's demineralized water you got, not deionized water. What we get at the mall is mostly done to avoid deposits on your clothes iron :p
some are more filtered than others, so depending on where you live, you will have readings completely different to someone's in another country.
In the absolute, it's totally fine, but when you start to monitor resistivity, DI water may be better, but again it's another can of worms because you get it in various grades too, and i never found any for sale anyway.
140 (if it's µS/m) is almost tap water level, but demineralized.
distilled water should be somewhere close to single digit, and deionized water would be off scale in nano Siemens.

Weird chemistry happening in your reservoir :p

I'm running distilled water in my little test loop which yields 9.8 µS/cm (distilled.jpg)

Can I use the temperature reading from the High Flow Next to control my fan speeds?

of course, just like with any other temp sensor

Zitat von »Remayz«

of course, just like with any other temp sensor

Thanks for responding but my apologies (my question wasn't clear), I meant can it control fan speeds independent of other Aquacomputer products. i.e. Would I be able to control fan speeds with only a High Flow Next, but after asking the question I realised it doesn't have fan headers and the BIOS probably wouldn't display its readings/values.

I thought I might be able to purchase just the High Flow Next (without purchasing a Quadro for instance), but then it occurred to me that my motherboard BIOS won't see the High Flow Next's readings.

Apologies for the double post but, another question....

Does the High Flow Next have to be physically linked to a Quadro for them to work together in the software?

Thanks,

Nop, but if the Next has a temp sensor output it's good to connect it to the Quadro, so that it will continue working if the service was to crash for any reason
Anyway there's fallback speeds on the Quadro if it loses the control sensor so you're safe either way.

If not connected together, you just add the Next temperature to the Quadro software sensors, and control fan speeds based on this one.
Connected together or not, it works the same in Aquasuite.

Zitat von »Remayz«

Nop, but if the Next has a temp sensor output it's good to connect it to the Quadro, so that it will continue working if the service was to crash for any reason
Anyway there's fallback speeds on the Quadro if it loses the control sensor so you're safe either way.

If not connected together, you just add the Next temperature to the Quadro software sensors, and control fan speeds based on this one.
Connected together or not, it works the same in Aquasuite.

That's brilliant thank, you so much, that's really helpful.

One thing I read, I think on reddit...?...is that because of how the High Flow Next's temp sensor is recessed deep in the unit, it adds 2 degrees Celsius to the actual coolant temperature? I'm reluctant to use its inbuilt temp sensor for that reason?

I'm trying to find the post...I'll see if I can post a link.

Edit: It was in this thread: high flow NEXT - The next generation of flow sensors

The High Flow Next's temp sensor is 1 to 2 degrees Centigrade off?

my high flow 2 is almost 1° off too (i have 3 sensors on the loop) but you can just offset the temperature on aquasuite.

Awesome, cool...thanks.

I've got two inline sensors on their way to me, because I was reading you can use the Quadro to control fans based on a temperature delta...

...I'm not sure if it's really necessary to do that...?...but I had to buy something extra for free shipping from Amazon...so...I bought 2

Are there advantages to having multiple temp sensors...?...or is it just for getting more info on how the system's operating?

for fan control based on temperature delta you want it to be the delta between water and ambient temperature (so, add a sensor that you'll leave dangling off the case out of sight).
That allows your fans to adapt their speed no matter what the temp is in your room.
Having two inline sensors, and a flow sensor allows you to measure real dissipated power in your loop. that's not exactly useful but a fun reading to have
the only catch is that you have to have your radiators in series (no waterblock in between rads), one sensor before, one sensor after.
With flow, temperature delta between inlet and outlet, and the water specific heat value, you can create a virtual sensor to display the power dissipated in watts in real time.